Refereeing Noncontact Rugby 53012 Refereeing NonContact Rugby 1
Refereeing Non-contact Rugby 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 1
Overview • About Rugby • About Refereeing Rugby • The Non-Contact Game – Basic rugby principles • Adapting from the tackle game – Referee positioning • Concluding Points 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 2
Preamble • Originally developed by USA Rugby Youth Rules Committee including members from Youth Committee, Game Development Committee, and Referees Association • Suggestions are welcome – Suggestions are received, evaluated, and Rules of Play adjusted accordingly • Rules of Play describe game played by relatively experienced players • For less experienced players: – Referees may decide to not stop play for minor infringements • Be even-handed – Certain parts of the game (rucks, mauls) may be taught later 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 3
Preamble • Rules of Play are worded to describe what players and match officials should do • Coaches should coach players to properly appreciate and demonstrate play consistent with these Rules of Play 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 4
About Refereeing Rugby • Call what you see • Not what others may think they see – Appointed touch judges can aid ref in “seeing” • "Be there" • Communicate what you see • Non-contact game specifics • Partly a coach, mostly an educator: encouragement » techniques » fan management • Never a policeman (who just penalizes) • Always a communicator • Eventually an exceptional manager. . . 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 5
Non-Contact Overview • Principles • Safety • Space • Support and continuity (adapting the tackle game) – The Tag – Ruck/Mauls – Restarts • Positioning 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 6
Principles: Safety • Safety is paramount! (there may be age, size or gender differences) – Tag is a tag, not a shove or push (regardless of intent) P. K. – Blocking/obstructing… P. K. – Diving on someone with the ball P. K. – Chasing after a ball [pushing/shoving] P. K. 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 7
Principles: Space • Critical for good play to occur – referee defines/enforces the offside lines – communicate! • Offside lines at – set pieces (lineout, scrum, kicks) – at the maul or ruck • Space at the tag – no blocking the passing lanes by the tagger – one meter from the ball carrier after the tag 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 8
Principles: Support and Continuity • Tag (adaptation of the tackle game) – Tag situation = Tackle situation • TWO (2) hands at the same time • From waist to knee – When tagged • keep running • Play the ball 'immediately' 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 9
Principles: Support and Continuity • At the tag, the ball carrier must play the ball immediately • if not immediately, defensive team gets the scrum • 'play' usually means pass – but could mean place it on the ground • Referee defines 'immediately' – Dependent upon players experience/skill level • time/steps to the pass • existence of support • awareness of support – Balance giving the kids a chance vs. increasingly challenge the athletes 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 10
Positioning • In general play – on a line through the ball and parallel to the try lines – be close enough to see the tag/hear the “ruck" or "maul" called…. but not in the way! • At the scrums – beside the scrum half to insure "crouch, touch, pause, engage" sequence – then slightly behind the defensive scrum, so as to see when the ball is out, yet be out of the way • At the lineouts – at the front of the line during formation to coach them into place; then move to one side. Then follow the ball 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 11
Concluding Points • Attitudes – Players: trash talking, taunting – Coaches, Parents: abusive. . . – Yours: helpful, not dictatorial • • Be fair and helpful to both sides Communicate / Explain After the game, join in Above all, have fun!! 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 12
Non-Contact Rules of Play • Note: Penalties are not included in this presentation – Refer to Rules of Play 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 13
Ground and Ball • Law 1 – Ground – Older participants, full size field – Younger Participants, reduce field size • Maintain touch lines, in-goal, 22 meters, 10 meters • Law 2 – Ball – U 17, #5 – U 15, #4 – U 11, #4 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 14
Number of Players • 7 (3 forwards and 4 backs) • Free subs at beginning of each period – 3 subs allowed during period – Subbed players may not play until next period • Exception: injury, but only if there are no other replacements available – No subs allowed on pitch until dead ball and w/ referee’s permission • Player replaced for injury may not play until next period • Yellow card – 5 minutes • Red card – may not play, nor be replaced for the match 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 15
Clothing • Suitable clothing for running, falling down, getting dirty, etc. • All items are to be soft, pliable material – Exception: boots – Prohibited: • Eyeglasses • Harnesses, braces, helmets containing metal or hard plastic 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 16
Time • • 4 periods of 10 minutes maximum each Half time break is 10 minutes max Other intervals are 2 minutes max Referee may stop clock for injury, equipment changes, incidents of foul play 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 17
Match Officials • Referee holds coin toss – Winning captain chooses field end to defend or kick off – If kick off chosen, then losing captain chooses field end to defend • Referee is sole judge of fact and Law – Team coaches, other team officials, and others may not questions referee's authority or decisions • Includes parents, players, etc. • When referee blows the whistle, all action stops – Exception – kickoffs • Referee may appoint touch judges to assist 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 18
Mode of Play • Match started with kick-off • Any player on-sides: – – – – 5/30/12 may take the ball run with it throw or kick the ball give or pass the ball to another player tag an opposition ball carrier fall on the ball ground the ball in an in-goal area take part in a scrum, ruck, maul, line-out Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 19
Advantage • Takes precedence over most laws • Allows play to be more continuous • Referee should not stop play if non-infringing team is likely to gain advantage • Referee is sole judge • For very young/inexperienced players, referee may decide to “play-on” despite certain minor/unintentional infringements – Be even handed for both team 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 20
Method of Scoring • Try: 5 points – Player first to ground ball in opponents in-goal • Penalty try: 5 points – Probable try except for opponent foul play • Conversion: 2 points – Place or drop kick on a line parallel to touch line thru point where try was scored • Penalty kick: 3 points – Place kick or drop kick at or on line parallel to touchline behind point of awarded penalty • Drop Goal: 3 points – Permitted during general play • Not immediately after free kick 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 21
Foul Play • Player and opposition running for ball – neither shall charge or push other • except with the shoulder • Equal and opposite pressure • Player shall not prevent opponent from tagging ball-carrier – By blocking path to ball carrier • Players may not twist, grab, push, pull opposition – Including during tags, rucks, mauls, lineouts, scrums, general play, etc. – Ball carrier or not 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 22
Foul Play • Opposition may not force or attempt to force ball from ball carrier’s hands • Opposition shall not hold an opponent – Except in scrum, ruck, maul • Opposition shall not attempt a tag by diving or leaving their feet. • Players shall not do anything that is: – Unsafe or dangerous for that player or any other player – Against the spirit of good sportsmanship • Players shall not repeatedly infringe any Rule or Rules 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 23
Foul Play • Collisions – All players are responsible to avoid collisions – Players may not run into opposition in a manner that causes a collision • Opposition vs. ball carrier • Ball carrier vs. opposition – Players may not step into the path of the opposition in a manner that causes a collision – A player must avoid collisions with opponent who has just kicked the ball – Referee decides who caused collision • Unintentional, yet match impact =>scrum to team last in possession 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 24
Foul Play • Penalty – Most cases, penalty kick – Foul play prevents probable try => penalty try – Temporary suspension (yellow card) => 5 minutes w/ no replacement in that time • Serious foul play • Repeated infringements – Send off of player (red card) => remainder of match • Very serious foul play • Continued repeated infringements • No replacement for match and possibly balance of tournament 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 25
Off-side & On-side General Comment: Player may not be in front of a teammate who has the ball or last played the ball. • Be proactive – Communicate with players • Warn them that they need to get on-sides or that they are off-sides (stand still or retreat) • Let them know when they are on-sides 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 26
Off-side & On-side • Ball has been kicked – Teammates in front of kicker must not move forward or take part in play until on-sides – Off-side players within 10 meters of where ball will land or where opposition is waiting to receive the ball must move away – Penalty: P. K. at point of infraction or scrum at original kick location • How to be put on-sides from kick – Team-mates on-side pass off-side player – Non-kicking team • Blocks kick • Passes or kicks ball • Runs with ball 5 meters 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 27
Off-side & On-side • Rucks, mauls, scrums, line-outs – Each has off-side lines • Refer to each relevant rule of play – Off-side player becomes on-side • Opponent runs 5 meters with ball • Opponent kicks ball • Opponent passing ball DOES NOT create on-sides – Penalty: P. K. at infringement location • Accidental offside – Ball carrier runs into teammate who is in front • Penalty: scrum if opponent prevented from tagging ball carrier • Knock-on and teammate off-sides plays ball – Scrum if opponents not deprived of advantage – P. K. otherwise 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 28
Knock-on and throw forward • Knock-on – Ball dropped forward or – Ball hits players hand or arm, goes forward, and – Touches another player or ground before original player can catch it • Kick charge down – Not knock-on unless player tried to catch ball • Throw forward (Forward pass) – Player throws/passes ball forward • Penalty: Scrum to opponent at infringement location 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 29
Kick-off and Restart Kicks • At each period start – Drop kick at center of half-way line – Team kicking at 1 st & 3 nd period decided by coin toss • Team kicking at 2 rd & 4 th period is other team • • • After score, team who scored will kickoff Teammates behind kicker Opposition 10 meters from half way line Opposition may not move forward until kick Play on! – If kicked ball travels 10 meters or opposition plays ball • Kicker’s team may play ball after it travels 10 meters 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 30
Kick-off and Restart Kicks • Ball does not travel 10 meters or kicking team touches ball first before ball travels 10 meters – Opposition picks re-kick or scrum at center of half way line • Ball goes directly into touch – Opposition picks re-kick, lineout, or scrum at center of half way line • Ball goes directly into in-goal without touching opposition and is grounded immediately – Scrum at half way line – If kick was from far 22 drop-out, then scrum back at far 22 – Throw-in by opposition • Younger players…consider – Distance less than 10 meters for ball travel from kick – A couple chances at completing a drop kick – Place kick 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 31
Kick-off and Restart Kicks (Drop -outs) • • Drop kick from anywhere behind the 22, must cross 22 Kicker teammates must be behind kicker Opposition may not prevent the kick from crossing 22 If kick goes directly into touch or does not cross 22 – Scrum at 22 to opposition – Another drop-out – Line-out where ball went into touch to opposition 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 32
Ball on Ground, No tackle • • Player may pick it up, kick it, fall on it On ground w/ ball => get up with it, pass, release it Player may not stay on ground with ball waiting for help Player on ground touched by opposition w/ both hands on torso or legs – Must pass or release ball – After playing ball, must get back on feet to join game • Players on feet may play ball when it leaves hands of player on ground – On feet => feet support player – On hands and feet means not on feet – On knee and foot => not on feet 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 33
Ball on Ground, No tackle • Players from both teams on ground – Ref declares player who wins ball • “Red ball, blue get away, red play it!” – If ref cannot decide, scrum to attacking side • Ref makes sure – Players not diving dangerously – Players not using bodies to shove opposition away – Players not falling over (on top of) • Players may kick ball on ground – May not do so, if hands (other body parts) are in vicinity of ball – Player must be on his/her feet 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 34
Tag • Simultaneously touches ball carrier with both hands anywhere from waist to knees – Can not be a push, shove, grab, pull, block, etc. • • • Can only occur in playing area (Includes in-goal) If ruck or maul declared, then no tag allowed Opponent must be on feet for tag Ball carrier may not fall to ground to avoid tag Tagged ball carrier must play the ball immediately – Pass or release ball (can let go of ball, roll it back, hurl it back, etc. ) – Ball carrier may continue to run when playing the ball • Time duration adjusted to challenge ball carrier to successfully play the ball – Ball carrier may not intentionally put ball into touch 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 35
Tag • Tagger: – – May not intercept ball when played May not touch the ball, whether passed, placed, thrown, etc. May not touch ball until another player from either team touches the ball Must move away from ball carrier and assume neutral position • May not move towards support player of ball carrier • May leave neutral position when ball leaves ball carrier hands – May catch ball if passed directly to tagger • Who has observed the above • All opponents – Must observe one meter distance from ball carrier • No part of opponent may be in one meter zone • Allows extension of ball carrier’s hands to make pass • Opponents other than tagger – May position selves between ball carrier and support – May intercept ball when played outside the 1 meter zone 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 36
Tag • If ball carrier plays ball by placing it on the ground instantly: – A tag zone (one meter radius around ball) is created – No steps may have been taken before placement • When tag zone created: – Ball carrier and tagger must get out of the way • Out of tag zone into neutral position • May rejoin action after others possess ball or ball leaves tag zone – Other players may enter tag zone from “gate” • If player enters tag zone and gains possession of ball: – Must play the ball or leave tag zone immediately • Opponent entering tag zone legally may tag new ball carrier • New ball carrier may declare ruck or maul prior to tag • No offsides outside of tag zone – If ball vacates tag zone back to opponent, opponent may play ball 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 37
Tag • The tagged player after playing the ball may not intentionally touch the ball again until the ball: – has been made dead – has been touched by an opposition player – has been touched by a team-mate 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 38
Tag • Tagger approaches tryline and starts to reach out to touch ball down ingoal as tag occurs – Movement allowed to continue and try or touch down awarded if successful • Tag in-goal (See In-Goal) 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 39
Ruck • • Can only occur in field-of-play No contesting of ball during ruck Al least one player from each team close to ball for a ruck How ruck occurs – Ball carrier, before tag, places ball on ground, crouches over it, declares “ruck” – Ball on ground, player crouches over it, declares “ruck” • If “ruck” declared, then tag not possible and declarer must ruck • If tag made before ruck actions completed, then referee declares “tag” • Collisions must be avoided – Priority given to first player attempting to crouch over ball • “Red Ruck!” – Players must be on their feet to declare “ruck” – Player over the ball, not declaring ruck => obstruction • If tag zone created – Players must enter from “gate” to attempt a ruck 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 40
Ruck (Declared) • Person who declared “ruck” is setter – Opponent closest to setter must get in front of setter and crouch down – Both players shall “bind” => place hand on other’s shoulder • All other players must retire behindmost foot on their side • Additional player from each team must come from on-sides – Bind onto teammate (either side) already in ruck • Arm around torso • All ruck players must be in crouched position • Ruck may not move • Ball may not be removed until setter and teammate are properly bound – Taken out of ruck by third teammate (not tagged ball carrier or tagger) – Heeled back • Then any on-sides player from either team may approach ball – Not tagged ball carrier or tagger 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 41
Ruck (Declared) • When all four players join ruck, then “ruck over” declared • Opponents join ruck significantly before setter teammate, then “Turnover” => scrum to opposition • If ball on ground because tagged ball carrier placed it down instantly: – Ball carrier and tagger may not: • Join ruck , remove ball from ruck, be first to touch ball if heeled from ruck 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 42
Maul • Can only take place in field of play • No contest of ball during maul • Ball carrier in proximity of opposition, turns away from opponent goal line (and has not been tagged) and calls “maul” – If tagged before declaring “maul”, then referee declares “tag” – Ball carrier must set a maul • Any player may take part in maul – Include players in neutral position from earlier tag • Opposition in proximity must join maul – From behind ball carrier and bind , holding ball carrier on hips – Second opponent joins behind first and bind, hands on hips • Ball carrier teammate, joins from behind ball carrier – Takes ball from ball carrier and turns back to former ball carrier – Former ball carrier binds on teammate • All other players must get on-side – Behind last foot, on their side 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 43
Maul • Ball may not be released until former ball carrier binds on teammate – After teammate had taken ball and turned • When all four players have joined maul, then “maul ended” – Supporting player must hand or throw ball backwards • Allowing any on-side player to play the ball • If two opposition players bind significantly before ball carrier supporter joins, then “turnover” => scrum • If ball carrier supporter joins significantly before two opposition players, then referee declares “advance” – Maul walks forward until second opposition player joins – Maul does not advance before referee declares “advance” – Opposition may not resist advance 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 44
Mark • Same as tackle game. • Rarely used. • Consult tackle laws 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 45
Touch & Line-out • Sidelines = touch lines • Out of bounds => In touch • In Touch – Ball crossed vertical plane of touch line and touched ground or other object beyond touch line – Touch line is in touch – Ball carrier touches touch line or ground beyond => in touch • Player outside 22 and: – Kicks ball in touch on the full, then line out in line to kick location – Kick bounces before in touch, then in line to where ball crossed touch line • Player inside 22, then in line where ball crossed touch line – Same if penalty kick – See next slide • Except for penalty kick, opposition throws in • If within five meters of tryline, line out moves to five meters 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 46
Touch & Line-out • Opposition must have caused ball to go inside the 22 for “inside the 22” rules to hold – Scrums or line-outs starting inside 22 • Ball carrier or teamates may not take ball inside the 22 for “inside 22” rules to hold 5/30/2012 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 47
Touch & Line-out • Contested (U 9 exception) – Players going for ball, not each other • Maximum of four players in line out – Two jumpers, thrower, receiver (optional) – All other players ten meters back or goal line, if closer, until ended • • Thrower stands in touch at mark of touch Jumpers ½ meter from line of touch, 5 to 15 meters in-field Receivers between 5 and 15 meters, separate from jumpers Non-throwing thrower between touch line and 5 meters to side of line of touch – Distances may be reduced for younger players 5/30/2012 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 48
Touch & Line-out • Thrower throws ball down line of touch – Any jumper may go for ball – Go for ball, not opposition – Ball must go 5 meters • • Not straight => scrum or line out decision by opposition Before throw in, jumpers must stay on their side of line of touch When ball is thrown, jumpers may go for ball possession Referee – Make sure jumpers do not jump too soon – Other players stay back 10 meters (or goal line) 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 49
Touch & Line-out • Ball is tapped, leaves line out or travels 15+ meters in field, then off side lines ended • If ball controlled in line out, ruck or maul can be created (prior to tag) – New offside lines created for lineout players • Quick line outs allowed – Throw in behind mark of touch – Ball travels 5+ meters 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 50
Scrum • Starts play after minor infringement (knock-on, forward pass) – Unintentional offsides/obstruction – Non-offending team throws ball in • Ball/Ball carrier contacts referee resulting in advantage – Team possessing ball puts it in • Check In-goal law for other situations • Scrum composed of two front rows, three players each – Outside players (props) bind over or under middle player (hooker) – Each front row in line with each other – Each front row stay tightly bound until scrum over • Front rows arms length, max, from each other – Referee declares “crouch” => front rows bend at knees and waist – Referee declares “touch” => Props reach to opposite prop on outside shoulder • Left prop’s outside arm goes inside outside arm of opposite prop – Referee declares “pause” => allows review positioning of both front rows – Referee declares “engage” => front rows step forward, engage along line of shoulders and back of neck • Outside hand grasps direct opponent on torso 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 51
Scrum • Front rows position selves so head is to left of direct opposition head – The hooker can not play as #8 – No one in scrum can release until ball is out of scrum • Each player in front row support their own weight • Scrum is uncontested – Proper form is still required – No pushing, pulling, twisting, etc. – Only team putting in ball may attempt to hook ball • Scrum half (usually to left of scrum) must put ball in quickly – – – Two handed toss, straight down center line of tunnel Hooker hooks ball be sweeping foot, bringing ball thru legs Soft sweep so ball stays under scrum Proper form required Hooker must support self • Scrum half goes behind scrum to remove ball from scrum 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 52
Scrum • Offsides – Opposition scrum half = both feet behind ball on side ball put in • For U 9 and U 11, offsides is middle of scrum • May not come around to other side of scrum – Other players not in scrum = 5 meters from scrum – Player other than scrum half may remove ball from scrum • Scrum half may not shield that player from tag • Players may not fake ball leaving scrum • Ball leaves scrum – => ball is out – Offsides lines disappear • Referee positioning – Refs should be positioned to assure that backs are 5 meters from last foot of scrum, especially the defensive backs 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 53
Penalty Kicks and Free Kicks • Most situations – penalty and free kicks awarded at point of infringement • Never closer than 5 meters from opponents goal line • Scrum is an option at the mark • Kick must be a clear kick – Foot must propel/move the ball from the hand or mark – Bouncing on the knee is not a kick • Kick can be in any direction • Teammates of kickers must put selves onsides, behind the kicker as soon as possible – Offsides: no penalty unless teammates affects play before onsides 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 54
Penalty Kicks and Free Kicks • Opponents may not interfere with ball or kicker • Must get back ten meters or tryline, whichever is closer • If kick taken before opponents are onside, they may not participate before they are onsides • Penalty kick – opponents must stay 10 meters or tryline until kick taken • Free Kick – opponents can charge forward as kicker starts to move to kick • Player may score goal with penalty kick – Not with Free Kick 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 55
In-goal • Rugby in-goal = football end zone – – Tryline is in-goal Base of goal post pads, in contact with ground is in-goal Touch-in-goal is not in-goal Dead ball line is not in-goal • In in-goal: – – There are off-sides, knock-ons, obstruction There are no rucks, mauls, scrums, line-outs Attacking teams score tries Defense make touch-downs • Tries and touch-downs, ball must be grounded – Ball carrier must touch ball to ground in in-goal – If ball on ground in in-goal • Player must press down with hand/s, arm/s, chest or belly • Player out of playing area may reach across line and place a hand on the ball 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 56
In-goal • Referee must see the grounding – To insure that it is performed correctly – To determine which team performed the grounding • If referee can not determine team who grounded ball – Five meter scrum to attacking team • • If attacker first ground ball, try is awarded & restart with midfield kickoff Defender ground ball in in-goal – If defending team brought ball into in-goal, 5 meter scrum to attackers – If attacking team sent ball into in-goal, then 22 dropout • Attacker kicks ball thru in-goal & out of playing area, w/o defender making contact – Choice of 22 drop out or scrum where ball first kicked • Ball carrier tagged in-goal => ball held up – 5 meter scrum for attacking team • Ball carrier in motion of grounding ball when tagged – Touch-down or try awarded if grounding successful • Knock-ons in-goal, 5 meter scrum in line where knock-on occurs 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 57
Obstruction • Obstruction only occurs if the action of the offense prevents a would be tagger from making the tag – If the ball carrier is alongside of or in front of a teammate and then runs behind that teammate and the opposition is 5 yards away, for example, it’s not an obstruction – If the ball carrier is one foot away from a tagger and runs behind a teammate, preventing a sure tag, then it is an obstruction – If a teammate is in front of an advancing ball carrier and a defender is coming up for the tag (and is in front of the ball carrier’s teammate) and the ball carrier shifts left and right behind the teammate, using the teammate as a pick, it is obstruction. 5/30/12 Refereeing Non-Contact Rugby 58
- Slides: 58